advertising

[raymond guterman]

I am aware that the best way that new people come into our churches in when our members invite their neighbors, friends, family, etc. However, with the loss of nearly 60,00 active members last year, I would like to see our denomination consider a national advertising
campaign, as well as produce ads that local churches can use in newspapers, etc. Our Methodist friends seem to do this well. I know it's expensive, but so is the thought of the extinction of the pcusa by 2038.
raymond guterman
ocala, fl.

[Adrian Pratt]

As far as generic v personalised ad... I take the point about what phone number do you use! And Rob Bullock's point about 'both/and' is valid. But again that ugly issue of finance raises its head. My guess is that most of us would need some 'data' on what expected returns we could expect from our investment in TV adds... should we decide to go either the local congregation or the denominations route. The reality... it seems... is that we have an ever decreasing pot of gold to draw from that could fund such ventures. All of which sounds like I'm pouring cold water on the idea. Not so. You would think that if the local car dealership can flood the airwaves with inane 30 second spots then surely the local (or national) church can do something of value! I think what I'd like to see are some 'success' stories from religous groups... linking growth to TV... before investing time and talents.

[Rob Bullock]

The national office is not currenlty running spots, but there are some congregations and presbyteries that are. East Tennessee Presbytery has been doing some cool things with a mix of the Here and Now spots, billboards near their congregations, and helping their churches with better signage, outreach events, bumper stickers, etc. There's a story about it here: www.pcusa.org/pcnews/2008/08380.htm. Donna Hopstead, East Tennessee's media consultant, was at GA this summer and offered to help any other presbyteries that would like to do something similar.

[Rob Bullock]

PS: Donna is a member on this site so you can contact her from the Members tab.

[Donna R. Hoppestad]

Hi - I'm Donna, the marketing and advertising consultant for the Presbytery of East Tennessee, and obviously a very neglectful member of this cool new website! Sorry!

I'd love to tell you what we are doing here in East Tennessee! It's been very exciting, and yet sort of sobering all at the same time. I am a lifelong PC(USA) member, a preacher's kid, elder, and former DCE, so when I began this project I was not totally unaware of the challenges many of our churches face in terms of dwindling numbers, aging congregations, smaller budgets, and all the other things associated with, let's face it, a very sick organization (note I did not say dying). Now that we've begun "New Vision", however, I know that this is not a minute too soon.

New Vision is a combination of regional advertising (we used the denomination "Here and Now" television ads, but developed our own series of billboards that have been infinitely more successful) and local training. The Presbytery pays for the regional advertising and pays me, and also has a small grant program for churches to use when they start a new outreach project. My job is to coordinate the advertising (I was in that business before I became the "church lady", as my kids call me), and most importantly, go to our churches to help them with ideas for local outreach.

I usually speak to congregations during a lunch or Wednesday night supper, and have a Powerpoint that explains the regional part - I tell them about the advertising, how it can help them in their own neighborhoods, and then they tell me about their communities, the history of their church in the community, and evangelism projects they have attempted in the past. Finally, we talk about new ideas. I have some really cheap and free things that they can try. I also attempt to link churches up to work with each other, and personalize each presentation to the church to maximize effectiveness.

We are just now printing the first banners that match the billboards (branding, of course), being paid for by the Presbytery (not as expensive as you might think) for each church with their personal information added. In addition to the banners, we have postcards, stickers, cling-ons for windshields, it goes on and on, available for each church to use as they think is best for them.

I'm really pushing the branding, and it's slowly sinking in. I'm a big believer in this (it works, it really does), and our members are beginning to see some results. They have a great conversation starter now with their friends (did you see our billboard?), and they are thinking "outside the box" concerning outreach (think festival booths, involvement in parades, giving out Presby water at races, putting signs up at softball games, giving out Presby crayons - the list is endless and very few are expensive).

We also talk about what to do when people visit and how to create a comfortable atmosphere - one that makes the visitors feel like they'd like to visit again. We sometimes talk about bulletins, where to sit in the sanctuary (that doesn't have to be your lifelong seat!), and even furniture placement and refreshment possibilities. The conversation is endless, but our main objectives are to make sure that: 1) our churches don't feel like they are on their own; 2) they know that if they need assistance or just some cheerleading, they have someone they can call, and 3) they have ideas that they can implement even when they don't have any money.

Please respond if you want to hear more about this - I'll share all of this if you are interested.

[Adrian Pratt]

Donna,
Thanks for the info. It gives a picture of what can be done. I think your comments about 'what to do when people visit' are also sadly neccesary. We are so used to not having new people that we forget what an intimidating and alien experience it can be for the unchurched to walk through our doors!

[Skip Dunford]

I'm "Johnny-come-lately" to this discussion, so it may be that nobody is engaged any longer! But, I had some thoughts on the subject.
First, our folks have made a decision to focus our limited media $$$ on pointing people to our church website. This, after having it languish in limbo for awhile, after our go-to webperson moved away. The idea is that more and more, people are finding what they want on the web, especially in our fairly fluid population.
Also, by now you may have discovered that can add a link to the PCUSA "Here and Now" video spots to your webpage, no charge. They also have print material and radio spots that can be tagged for your local market.
Having said that, I agree with those who think the denomination should be encouraged to do national "top of the head" spots. Has the "squeaky wheel" campaign started working on our new "techno-head" Moderator?

[Bruce Reyes-Chow]

Skip . . . let us now resort to name calling ;-)

i do know there has been some conversations about ads, branding, imaging, etc. with one of the questions, "Do we even know what we are branding?" Do we focus on internal or external? Do we capitalize on technologies that make some of the fiscal issues obsolete?

Lastly . . . I wonder what my office and time as Moderator could do to help . . . thoughts?

[Naphtali Moore]

I think that the Internet could well be the nexus for denominational outreach. It would bridge the local and the national campaigns. Everyone keeps asking, what phone number do you put on a national ad. What's a phone??? Hehe. It's all about cells, texting, im-ing and the web now a days. Its about making that immediate, intimate and personal connection. A national campaign would do best to list PCUSA.org. The national site should be designed as a portal directing people to their local churches website. Local churches can already include their uri in their PCUSA church directory listing. As for a phone number, sure have a national phone bank that would do some low level of counseling. (FAQ, prayer chain, resource direction) And they too would then direct the call to the church closest to them.

As the web master for my churches website I would say having clear, sound and professional content would be a huge plus. The "Here and Now" stuff is a nice eye catcher but it has no meat. Here are some suggestions:

- It would be awesome if the national organization focused on creating on line video and graphic Bible tracks, Bible studies etc.

- Providing more tools like the Web Medley rss aggragator would be great too.

- Printed brochures and Bible tracks with a blank space for a church to add its information would be nice too. They could just have a stamp made or print labels.

- I'm having business cards made up for myself. They list the church website and have a small gospel message on back.

- A simple graphic program that inserted a churches name and info into the PC USA produced graphics and emailed them to the local web masters would be great. It would provide denomination wide consistency and still allow for a personal touch.

- Naphtali Moore
buckleypresbyterian.org

[David Parker]

Ok, so I've read through all of the comments about the advertising topic and I have a serious question. BRC brings up a good point when he asks, "Do we even know what we are branding?" I am all for advertising if you have the resources to do so. We have taken out radio spots, newspaper ads, but no TV. We've looked at movie theater ads (before the show starts), but I wouldn't just do anything.

The question I have is what kind of message are we sending with the "Here and Now" campaign. Obviously this was put out a few years ago, but it still stands to question, Is this the message we want to send out. I mean, as I see the ads I am reminded of a big old institution that is happy being grandma's church. The ads are seemingly geared toward those in a younger generation, but the message is clear--when YOU'RE ready, we'll still be here.

Correct me if I'm off base, but I feel like if we're striving to make our church (local or national) a more missional body, why are we pushing an image that says we're gonna wait here until you show up--rather than we're going to get involved in your life while you're playing rugby, having a baby, driving your kids around--or whatever the clips show. Don't we want to BRAND our church as one that is involved in people's lives rather than staying put and waiting until they show up on their time?

I've thought this about this ad campaign since it came out and now I'm glad I've said my peace. thanks all!

[Naphtali Moore]

Ah, branding, my 'favorite' word. Evangelism is about preaching, sharing the Gospel, baptizing and teaching others to obey what Christ commanded. Perhaps the first question should be.... "Should we be branding ANYTHING; Christ, the church, the Gospel??" Is that what the Bible calls on us to do? Is that what Jesus did?

(reposted from http://deepandwide.ning.com/forum/topics/tell-me-a-story-how-were-you)
Christ came when there was no Internet, no TV, no radio, no printing press, not even a high level of literacy; two continents were still unknown to the people groups He directly touched. In spite of all of this the church exploded from a handful of disciples to thousands, then to perhaps 100's of thousands before we had the first mass media (printing press). Till that point evangelism relied on the folly of preaching. That is what God calls on us to do.

1 Cor 1:17 "For Christ did not send me to baptize (in his own name, read chapter for full context), but to preach the gospel – and not with clever speech, so that the cross of Christ would not become useless. 1:18 For the message about the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 1:19 For it is written, “I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and I will thwart the cleverness of the intelligent.” 1:20 Where is the wise man? Where is the expert in the Mosaic law? Where is the debater of this age? Has God not made the wisdom of the world foolish? 1:21 For since in the wisdom of God the world by its wisdom did not know God, God was pleased to save those who believe by the foolishness of preaching."

The medium by which we preach makes little difference; whether its by the written or spoken word. But falling into worldly language and means diminishes the cross. When we employ marketing, surveys and the other bells and whistles of this world we diminish the cross. The Greeks wanted wisdom, the Jews wanted signs, Americans want Hollywood glitz and the latest feel good series on marriage or how to manage your finances. God makes it clear that this is foolishness and we should rely on His word. I'm all for using every medium we can, and different tactics that causes the unsaved to pause long enough to preach to them; (ex: "stop light evangelism") so long as the means do not become the message in and of themselves.

Now, I think its critical that we make clear the difference in saving the unsaved and churching the un-churched. A saved person will find a church; Presbyterian or otherwise. They will seek out other Christians both because it is what God commands and because as Christians we love to be in community with other Christians. To that end our concern should be letting others know we truly are Christians. This is not done by branding but by love as the Bible tells us.

John 13:35 "By this all will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another."

This love in action extends to all parts of our lives and our church; from how we live each day, to our dedication to the Great Commission, to the more difficult parts including church discipline. It seems many churches just focus on the "social justice" role of the church to show their love and ignore the rest. They seem to think teaching discipline, depravity, Hell and the cross might offend and cause division. The cross is an offensive and foolish message to the unsaved. Christ Himself said He came bearing a sword or division.(Matt 10:34, Luke 12:52) But not sharing Christ and His cross first and foremost is dishonest and unloving.

Now what about ads and branding then. Ads are not the best medium for sharing the Gospel. If you reduce the Gospel down to 30 secs, a billboard or even a full page ad you can guarantee you're leaving something out. It took God 66 books we shouldn't think we can do it in one ad. I don't think anyone is suggesting that we try to and I just want to make clear that I'm not suggesting that either. But then what can an AD do for the church? I do think that they can be useful in planting a seed and being a pointer to the local church. The seed we plant as Christians is the word. To that end I would say every ad should include as much scripture as possible. Even a bill board or a business card can include at least once verse. Remember,

Isa 55:10-11 (KJV) "For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater: 11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it."

Give a verse, add an image, maybe even pose a question to engage the reader. Then just tag on event data (if the ad is for an event) and the churches data. Now we can rest on the promise of Isa 55:10-11, His word will not return fruitless.

As for branding... If you mean giving all ads a cohesive, consistent and visually appealing flare. I'm all for it. Clear readable fonts, planned out color schemes and professionally designed logos are great. It is only fitting and proper that we Presbyterians should do so, reflecting on 1 Corinthians 14:40 "Let all things be done decently and in order."
But if we rely on these things and not the word, or forsake the Gospel for worldly relevance to target a specific demographic then I would think we missed the narrow gate. There is nothing more relevant then the Gospel, for all have sinned and fallen short of the mark, including grandmas and rugby players. There is no greater way to get involved in someones life, then sharing Christ and His word, even if its one verse on a bill board.

[Donna R. Hoppestad]

I wonder, David, why you say that you wouldn't do just anything? Maybe that's what we should do - anything - maybe that's where we're needed most of all!
I totally agree with you concerning the missional aspect - I think that we should be out there everywhere, letting everyone know that they, like us, can be involved in something greater than themselves if they'd like to join us as we CHANGE THE WORLD. We need all the help we can get to accomplish that goal, but you're also right in that they aren't going to come to us - we've tried that for years and it hasn't been working all that well!
When we (Presbytery of East Tennessee) started using the Here and Now tv ads, we placed them on sports, HGTV, and shows like Family Guy. It worked out pretty well! We skipped the shows that church attendees tended to watch more - they weren't our target market. In the future, we plan to do our own ads to expand upon our "find" billboards. We'd also like to keep it simple, so that none of our churches feels "left behind"!

[David Parker]

Donna,

Thanks for your comment. I am happy to hear about what your presbytery is doing. Sounds exciting! I have actually copied your story from above and sent it to our Exec. we're beginning to talk a bit about advertising in our own area at the beginning of the year.

I said I wouldnt do just anything because in the "here and now" campaign it sends the message that we're just gonna wait for you to show up...that we're content to be who we are and if you'd like to join us and assimilate, well then that will be fine. I have been using more of a phrase of "joining together on the journey" because it is active, shows that our church isn't comfortable in being still and that we're looking for people to be active with us. Obviously, I'm not a pro at the advertising thing, but this is what we're doing.

I guess I just don't want people to get the "wrong" message when we're advertising in the church. Too often people already have a bad image of church, so providing another one isn't gonna help much. This is just my opinion...

thanks again for your comment!